On the subjects of Mary Sue-ing characters, writing about sex, and giving away too much of ourselves

[rsadelle]

I'm writing a Chris/Steve space AU, and I made a character decision about Chris. It made sense that if space AU Chris likes heat, enclosed spaces, and higher gravity, then he would like being held down. And then I've continued that character piece farther into the story. I even changed the casting of one of the other characters to go with it.

A long time ago, there was thread on some X-Files fic list or newsgroup (I wasn't kidding when I said it was a long time ago) called "No Mary Sues for Alex?" which tackled the relative dearth of Krycek/Mary Sue fic. I remember the conclusion being that people tended to just make Krycek their Mary Sue. I've been thinking about that as I've been working my way through this space AU.

(This is an interesting intersection with my continuing doubts about writing Chris. I don't think my Chris is anything like real Chris. [I think there's only one or two authors writing a Chris who's anything like real Chris.] On the other hand, I have to listen to real Chris with the aural equivalent of peeking through my fingers, so I'm not sure I would want to read real Chris.)

I've also been thinking of my favorite quote about writing about sex. It's from Tony Kushner, who says, "It is impossible to talk or write about sex without revealing too much of yourself. Whereas conversely it is possible I think to have sex and reveal nothing of yourself whatsoever."

I had an interesting experience with this. norwich36 and I exchange fic recs all the time. A lot of them are things with interesting plots or that are amusing, but a fair number of them are about things that are hot. We also had a relatively involved discussion about BDSMy stories way back on my post about the first J2 stories I read. She's also read some of my fic. I give you all this background so you know that we already talk about this kind of thing all the time. Then we started talking erotica ebooks over email, and I wrote a long email to her about the ebooks I've read. I was reading it over before I sent it, and I thought, "It's a good thing she knows me pretty well already, because this is pretty revealing." It was almost uncomfortably revealing. I think there are two things that made it so uncomfortable. First of all, ebooks take more of an investment than fic. They cost money, and you're stuck with them, so you have to choose carefully. Secondly, it was startling to look at the list all at once and see the pattern, especially in the things I bought myself (as opposed to the things I got from other people). Almost all the things I really liked, and a large number of the things I bought were BDSM or BDSMy. And yet, I've written a fair amount about kink, so I'm not sure why this particular email made me feel quite so exposed.

A Confession

Oh, no, wait, maybe I do at least know why I keep thinking/talking about this now. It's been weeks since I last wrote anything on either of the novels I'm supposed to be writing because I quit my job to be a writer. I've only admitted that to maybe two other people. If I tell the truth about my penchant for kink fic, does that balance out my not-telling about my writing?

Comments

[rosabella74.livejournal.com]

So, tell me who is the other person who writes Chris like the real Chris? Now you got me curious. BTW, I went to Steve Carlson's gig at the end of April, at Hotel Cafe. He totally pours his heart and soul into his music...Loved every minute of it. You made a pretty brave decision to follow your bliss... Me, not so brave. I was just telling my sister about the many things I didn't pursue for the sake of security and utterly boring predictable and shitty existence. OK, 'nuff about me. I can't wait for your reply. As usual!...

[rsadelle]

I think ethrosdemon's Chris/Jensen has the kind of tone that fits with real Chris. (It might be easiest to find it all by following the links from this post.)

I'm so jealous you got to see Steve in concert! It's totally in my plan to do that later this year - I'm going out of town this month, which should get me enough frequent flyer miles to be able to fly down to Southern California for free, plus I have friends who live in Anaheim who I can stay with and drag with me.

It's never too late to do some of those things!

[norwich36.livejournal.com]

I'm trying to remember if this was the post I originally want to reply to, or not. I agree with you that a lot of people, once they realize (a) how self-revealing Marysues are and (b) how much fandom as a whole hates them, learn to marysue themselves through canon characters.

Not that I think this is a problem, actually--any more than women writers getting drawn to write m/m slash because it gives them a neutral playing field to work out certain kinds of desires. (Heck, even without writing them down? Certain fantasies make my feminist brain a lot less uncomfortable if I'm having Jared, Jensen or JDM act them out in my head than if I picture myself in the same scenarios.)

You can't be too very worried about self-exposure if you're doing days of kink recs, though--or at least you're doing a good job of confronting your fears.

[rsadelle]

Oh, I don't think I'm at all saying we Mary Sue characters consciously (and I don't think that was the Krycek conversation, either). I think it mostly happens without us noticing, but once I notice it's what I'm doing, I find myself uncomfortable with it.

The two problems I, as a writer, have with Mary Sue-ing characters are (1) I worry that it makes them out of character and (2) I worry that people will notice and know a lot more about me than I intended them to (the large number of responses to brown_betty's Oh My God, I Can See Your Id! post seems to suggest that that's actually a legitimate worry). As a reader, I might not notice that Mary Sue-ing is the reason for an ooc character. I do, however, tend to pick up on someone putting too much of themselves into a character, and it makes me uncomfortable - I come out of it feeling like I know more than I wanted to about the author, and the idea that the author doesn't realize she's given away so much of herself makes me squirm.

I've been thinking about that critical feminist brain: my critical feminist brain occasionally pops in to ask, "Do you like sub kink because you like sub kink, or do you like sub kink because you've internalized the traditional narrative that says women are submissive?"

Saying directly how much I like kink fic in this post and the recs request post was so revealing that making kink recs doesn't seem that much more exposing. (I will admit, though, that I walked around blushing all day the day I made the anal beads rec.)